[READY FOR MERGE 2017-05-15] Second birthday post #168

carols10cents · 2017-05-07T16:58:08Z

Current status: everything is done, just waiting for the actual day to merge! Thank you everyone for your help!!

erickt · 2017-05-07T17:03:58Z

erickt · 2017-05-07T17:25:12Z

What about structuring the post into major sections aligned with each roadmap item, and how we're trying to address them?

learning curve: call out the book, and all the projects to improve error messages.
edit-compile-debug: progress on incremental compilation? Anything else in this space? Maybe posts to current build speed. perf.rust-lang.org?
IDE: RLS, the integration with rustup, and how easy it is to get it into VSCode.
High quality crates and 1.0 crates: link to libz blitz, call out projects that hit 1.0 this past year, if it's not too big?
high scale servers: tokio of course. Could also be interesting to call out projects like rocket, iron, and linkerd-tcp. not sure if there are other big projects in this space?
Build systems: not sure what's been going on here.
community mentoring: we got the youtube channel and rustbridge? It's still a bit incomplete though. Also had underhanded.rs and novemb.rs.

carols10cents · 2017-05-07T18:00:11Z

What about structuring the post into major sections aligned with each roadmap item, and how we're trying to address them?

Ooooh i like it!

Mark-Simulacrum · 2017-05-07T18:55:25Z

carols10cents · 2017-05-08T19:41:34Z

Thinking about the 2017 roadmap, I think I changed my mind. We haven't really been working towards those since Rust's last birthday, and 2017 isn't over yet. I'm going to work them in but frame it as a check-in of sorts that's part of this post.

Mark-Simulacrum · 2017-05-08T20:34:32Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+for analyzing it!*
+
+[benchmarks]: https://github.com/rust-lang-nursery/rustc-benchmarks
+[rss]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resident_set_size


No idea if we want to mention this here, but we could link to perf.rlo. It's somewhat not related, but does have data since January 24th this year.

… not happy.

carols10cents · 2017-05-10T16:35:11Z

I'm still waiting on a tiny bit about tokio but i'm ready for review now!

nikomatsakis · 2017-05-10T16:43:34Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+|-------|--------------|---------------|---------------|----------------|-----------------|------------------|
+| hyper 0.5.0 | 5.97s | 248MB | 5.44s | 234MB | -8.9% | -5.6 % |
+| html5ever 2016-08-25 | 5.16s | 234MB | 3.98s | 228MB | -22.9% | -2.6% |
+| issue-32062 | 10.40s | 127MB | 0.26s | 89MB | -97.5% | -29.9% |


I think I would remove the issue-XXX rows. They don't look like "real code" (because they're not), and they don't show anything extraordinary (in particular, I think that the gains here are also reflected in jld-day15-parser, although that may be coincidence, I can't remember if those are due to a similar cause).

nikomatsakis · 2017-05-10T16:44:01Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+| jld-day15-parser | 42.38s | 204 MB | 1.38s | 111MB | -96.7% | -45.6% |
+| tuple-stress | 4.62s | 260MB | 4.67s | 363MB | 1.1% | 39.6% |
+| rust-encoding 0.3.0 | 2.21s | 239MB | 1.91s | 163MB | -13.6% | -31.8% |
+| issue-32278 | 2.22s | 213MB | 1.98s | 138MB | -10.8% | -35.2% |


(Can we maybe do a graph of some kind?)

nikomatsakis · 2017-05-10T16:45:03Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+- September 9-10, 2016: [RustConf 2016] in Portland, OR, USA;
+- September 17, 2016: [RustFest 2016] in Berlin, Germany;
+- October 27-28, 2016: [Rust Belt Rust 2016] in Pittsburgh, PA, USA;
+- April 29-30, 2017: [RustFest 2017] in Kyiv, Ukraine.


these links are not working in rendered version

(not sure why)

I don't know why either, they work when I run jekyll locally so they should work in the published version.

steveklabnik · 2017-05-10T16:56:04Z

erickt · 2017-05-10T17:09:28Z

Looks great except for the missing tokio part!

carols10cents · 2017-05-10T18:03:26Z

I added a graph, great idea @nikomatsakis! It's a basic bar graph, if anyone wants to do something more fancy, please feel free to play in this google doc. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1fJkmsnzp-I2dyh0ZnETpqATyK9yR4_ZLy86_fwEMY8c/edit?usp=sharing

Ping me if you've made an update and I'll take another screenshot!

aturon

Thanks @carols10cents, this looks fantastic overall! I left a bunch of small notes, but my biggest worries are:

Framing the compiler performance results (and emphasizing incremental compilation to a greater degree).
Opening and closing sentences.

I'll get you the stuff waiting on me soon...

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:10:37Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+
+[group-pic]: /images/2017-05-Second-Birthday/rustfest-berlin.jpeg
+
+Rust, a systems programming language focused on safety, speed, and concurrency,


We should workshop the opening sentence, to get it up to date with the ways we've been trying to talk about Rust (which have evolved away from the old "trifecta").

Yeah I was trying to find where you were talking about... productive fearless systems programming? What was it?

Rust, a language for confident, productive systems programming

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:11:46Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+- 284 library stabilizations;
+- 10 languages [rust-lang.org] has been translated into;
+- 48 new companies [running Rust in production][friends];
+- 2 new teams (Docs and Style);


Also, Infra (which will be fully announced any moment now) and the Unsafe Guidelines strike team.

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:13:02Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+[Rust jobs website]: http://rustjobs.rs/
+
+[Dropbox] is using Rust in multiple high-impact projects to manage exabytes of
+data where correctness and efficiency is critical. Rust is currently shipping


s/Rust/Rust code/

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:13:53Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+first Firefox release that included Rust code as part of the [Oxidation]
+project. [Project Quantum], announced in October 2016, is an effort to
+incrementally adopt proven parts of Servo into Firefox's rendering engine,
+Gecko.


cc @metajack @jonathandturner, should we say more about Quantum here?

We could link to Potch's writeup as one possibility: https://hacks.mozilla.org/2017/05/quantum-up-close-what-is-a-browser-engine/

IMHO, I like that we just say we're incrementally adopting parts of Servo, and we don't necessarily call out specific ones.

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:15:28Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+[hackfest]: https://wiki.gnome.org/Hackfests/Rust2017
+
+This year, [npm] started using Rust in production to serve JavaScript packages,
+using Rust to eliminate performance bottlenecks in their platform that serves


says "using Rust" twice, maybe tighten up phrasing a bit.

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:35:57Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+- [The new error format rolled out in Rust 1.12.0](https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/issues/35233)
+- [The question mark operator stabilized in Rust 1.13.0](https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/pull/31954)
+
+### [Rust should have a pleasant edit-compile-debug cycle](https://github.com/rust-lang/rust-roadmap/issues/1)


I have the sense that this section as written is a bit "insider baseball", in the sense that it expects you already know about MIR and incremental comp. Some initial framing would be helpful.

Maybe we could talk about the user impact of each?

"A more user-friendly error format..."
"Easier to use error handling..."

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:37:39Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+[`cargo check`]: https://github.com/rust-lang/cargo/pull/3296
+[the 1.16 announcement]: https://blog.rust-lang.org/2017/03/16/Rust-1.16.html
+
+The work on incremental compilation is proceeding well. Nightly builds


We definitely need to get some numbers (or better, graphs) up in here, to offset the downer of the table above. Worst cast, we can pull from the beta post.

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:43:23Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+
+### [Rust should integrate easily into large build systems](https://github.com/rust-lang/rust-roadmap/issues/12)
+
+This initiative is mostly in the ideas stage; there's lots of great discussion


Could expand this slightly to say: we've done a lot of work with stakeholders to understand the challenges in build system integration today, and think we have a good overall vision for how to solve them, but there are a lot of details to be worked out.

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:48:06Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+
+[RustBridge]: https://github.com/rust-community/rustbridge
+
+There are many people who have started getting involved with various


Worth talking about:

The introduction of language team "shepherds", which is partly about mentoring a set of folks around the lang team (and has been somewhat successful at that).

The Libz Blitz is set up specifically to provide a lot of mentoring opportunities. We did something similar with error message improvements

We've been working to grow both the number and size of subteams, to create more opportunities for people to step into leadership roles.

Have Outreachy and GSOC interns this summer.

We should emphasize the "all levels" part of the roadmap item: it's about onboarding first-time contributors but also adding folks all the way up at the core team level.

aturon · 2017-05-11T00:49:01Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+
+## Rust in the future
+
+While Rust is still just a toddler, it's still growing and still going strong.


"While Rust is still just a toddler, it's still growing and still going strong." we should workshop this one, try to close out a bit stronger.

Do you have any suggestions? What would be stronger? More exclamation points maybe!!!! I'm feeling at a loss for words after all the rest of the words :)

sophiajt · 2017-05-11T01:41:07Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+
+[Dropbox] is using Rust in multiple high-impact projects to manage exabytes of
+data where correctness and efficiency is critical. Rust is currently shipping
+in the desktop client on Windows running on hundreds of millions of machines.


suggestion: bold "hundreds of millions"

sophiajt · 2017-05-11T21:49:03Z

_posts/2017-05-15-rust-at-two-years.md

+
+## Rust in the future
+
+While Rust is still just a toddler, it's still growing and still going strong.


How about "At two years old, Rust is finding its way into all corners of programming, from web development, to embedded systems, and even your desktop." Play on the toddler analogy without saying it, possibly.

… existing sections

carols10cents · 2017-05-12T22:31:59Z

@steveklabnik this is in your court now to merge and promote on monday when you deem it to be best social media time :)

carols10cents added 3 commits May 7, 2017 10:20

Start of Rust 2nd birthday post

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Outline-ish

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Update conferences section

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carols10cents added 2 commits May 7, 2017 14:09

Upgrade json gem; 1.8.3 won't install for me

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Add rustfest picture

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carols10cents added 2 commits May 8, 2017 11:51

Add photo credit

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Add benchmarks and analysis

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Mark-Simulacrum reviewed May 8, 2017

View reviewed changes

carols10cents and others added 9 commits May 8, 2017 17:05

Some progress, editing, rearranging. Might rearrange again, I'm still…

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… not happy.

Ok feeling good about this organization, still needs filling out

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Filling in

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Libz, conclusion

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More rewordings and notes

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dropbox

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add a paragraph about incremental compilation support

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credit

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more text on cargo check

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carols10cents changed the title ~~[NOT READY FOR REVIEW YET] Second birthday post~~ [REVIEW PLZ] Second birthday post May 10, 2017

nikomatsakis reviewed May 10, 2017

View reviewed changes

Remove issue benchmarks

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carols10cents added 2 commits May 10, 2017 13:49

Order table by original compilation time asc

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Added a graph

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fewer exclamation marks, sigh

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aturon reviewed May 11, 2017

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sophiajt reviewed May 11, 2017

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carols10cents added 8 commits May 11, 2017 13:32

Update teams

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Count steve leaving community

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Improve dropbox section

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Link to quantum blog post series

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No more using rust using rust

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Improve compile time perf section

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Add a graph from the incremental compilation post

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More detail on mentoring

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sophiajt reviewed May 11, 2017

View reviewed changes

carols10cents and others added 7 commits May 11, 2017 22:10

fearless

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metaphorical toddler

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Summarize compile time improvements

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Fill in most remaining gaps in birthday post; a bit more polishing on…

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… existing sections

Update Rocket pitch

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Clarify a few things

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Switch to https when supported

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carols10cents changed the title ~~[REVIEW PLZ] Second birthday post~~ [READY FOR MERGE 2017-05-15] Second birthday post May 12, 2017

carols10cents assigned steveklabnik May 12, 2017

Getting the latest numbers

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carols10cents merged commit d329342 into gh-pages May 15, 2017

carols10cents deleted the second-birthday branch May 15, 2017 15:50


		[group-pic]: /images/2017-05-Second-Birthday/rustfest-berlin.jpeg

		Rust, a systems programming language focused on safety, speed, and concurrency,


		### [Rust should integrate easily into large build systems](https://github.com/rust-lang/rust-roadmap/issues/12)

		This initiative is mostly in the ideas stage; there's lots of great discussion


		[RustBridge]: https://github.com/rust-community/rustbridge

		There are many people who have started getting involved with various


		## Rust in the future

		While Rust is still just a toddler, it's still growing and still going strong.

[READY FOR MERGE 2017-05-15] Second birthday post #168

[READY FOR MERGE 2017-05-15] Second birthday post #168

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carols10cents commented May 7, 2017 •

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